Real-world religions

[Gilgameš]

A question of religions is a tough one.

I've always felt that post-apocalyptic settings come off as much more believable if there is some link to real-life religions IN ADDITION to the general nuke-worshiping ghouls and weird cults. It is also true, that it would eventually spawn negative publicity also, but I consider it a risk worth taking.

For example, a faithful christian character who is not defined by his religion would be OK, so would a community of Hindus. Whereas "painful" real-life situations should be avoided. Muslim extremists (and making them an example is a big mistake for my part) for example would not be good. Religion can tell a lot about the personality of a character.

[TΛPETRVE]

Pastafarians and discordians, please!

[Drool]

Pastafarians and discordians, please!

Pastafarianism is just a tired, hipster-driven, retread of Discordianism. I'll take the original, thankyouverymuch.

As for the game, I'm hoping the Blood Cult makes a repeat appearance.

[TΛPETRVE]

Pastafarianism is just a tired, hipster-driven, retread of Discordianism.

Given that the whole FSM bullshit wasn't invented until a few years ago (and wouldn't have gone anywhere without the almighty internet), I guess there should be no place for it in WL2, anyway. On the other hand, I'd love to see an ongoing feud between Discordians and Pastafarians, accusing each other of plagiarism .

As for the Blood cult: Count me in. Same goes for the Servants of the Mushroom Cloud, of course.

I still hope they get a theme song...

[CaptainPatch]

As for the Blood cult: Count me in. Same goes for the Servants of the Mushroom Cloud, of course.

I can see something like the Servants of the Mushroom Cloud developing. After all, evidence of the handiworks of the Almighty Nuclear Weapon still abound scores of years later. Humans have made a practice of deifying that which they fear, dread, and/or do not understand over the millenia.

But the Blood Cult? On the one hand, the cult is organized, something that wouldn't be happening unless humans were making progress in regrouping and reestablishing Society. And Society can NOT tolerate any group that wantonly and indiscriminately murders its citizens. Thuggee was one such group that was hunted to extermination because of its human sacrifice element. The ONLY human-sacrifice group that had any lasting success was the Aztecs, and they only because they were the most powerful group around -- until the Spanish arrived. Then all of the subject groups that the Aztecs fed off of banded with the foreigners to drag down the Aztecs once and for all.

To a large extent, the Blood Cult was much like having a coven of vampires, a pack of werewolves, or a tribe of cannibals in the vicinity. Sooner or later, the more civilized population WILL hunt down and exterminate the threat.

[malthaussen]

The best argument against this idea is that it is bound to tick somebody off, and the developers shouldn't make a point of seeking sorrow.

-- Mal

[Inspector71]

One thing that I find off with most sci-fi games is all the religious that exists now have just disappeared. With the exception of firefly. So why instead of just tech cults can't we have remnants of real religions. Catholics, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Pasatafarians, would still exist in the wastes. I would add an interesting flavor to some communities. I know of several secluded sufficient ministrys around the Midwest that are in the middle on no where. They could be a nice way point. After the war I would expect many people trying to set up theocracies.

I think it would be cool if the Pastafarians had a town/area where they all now believed the religion was real and not the mockery that it is. Pictures of the spaghetti monster all over etc. Quite a bit of sub text/commentary there on religion as well. Not to mention hilarious.

[reiniat]

One thing that I find off with most sci-fi games is all the religious that exists now have just disappeared. With the exception of firefly. So why instead of just tech cults can't we have remnants of real religions. Catholics, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Pasatafarians, would still exist in the wastes. I would add an interesting flavor to some communities. I know of several secluded sufficient ministrys around the Midwest that are in the middle on no where. They could be a nice way point. After the war I would expect many people trying to set up theocracies.

I think it would be cool if the Pastafarians had a town/area where they all now believed the religion was real and not the mockery that it is. Pictures of the spaghetti monster all over etc. Quite a bit of sub text/commentary there on religion as well. Not to mention hilarious.

In the same way we can have a guy using a cruxified christ as weapon rack, and a toilet with a bible instead of toilet paper, and some other random buddy shouting about the apocalipsis in a dusty street in an abandoned town, and also a gunfu teaching school (wich may or may not be useful fot taught skills) with Neo posters all over the place, .

[Drool]

I think it would be cool if the Pastafarians had a town/area where they all now believed the religion was real and not the mockery that it is.

Feh. I'll stick with the original fake religion: Discordianism.

Stupid Johnny-come-lately pasta jerks...

[Inspector71]

This may be my naivety, but I don't think world religions would take a video game so seriously to go to court. I can see religious organizations being upset and decrying a product that they do not like how they are represented but legal action just seems like overreach. If they did attempt to sue, I doubt a judge would hear it. That case would be tossed out. Regarding lawsuits further, what exactly would they be suing over? Slander? Would an artist's interpretation of a possible future of an organization be some kind of defamation? I think you are thinking about it too deeply and I think fictional works and their artists have more freedom of expression than that.

Yes organized religions may get angry, but the only reason to keep religion out of the game is political correctness or real life religions not having any effect on gameplay or the world so no reason to include them. InXile certainly doesn't need to avoid using real religions due to fear of retaliation or lawsuits.

EDIT: Speaking of lawsuits, I think Scientology should also be in the game. They are primarily based in southern California and I think writing them a ridiculous future would be very satisfying.

Scientologists were already in Fallout 2. They were in San Francisco and called Hubonites.

Ahead of its time really. Not that you couldn't include them in this game as well.

[reiniat]

This may be my naivety, but I don't think world religions would take a video game so seriously to go to court. I can see religious organizations being upset and decrying a product that they do not like how they are represented but legal action just seems like overreach. If they did attempt to sue, I doubt a judge would hear it. That case would be tossed out. Regarding lawsuits further, what exactly would they be suing over? Slander? Would an artist's interpretation of a possible future of an organization be some kind of defamation? I think you are thinking about it too deeply and I think fictional works and their artists have more freedom of expression than that.

Yes organized religions may get angry, but the only reason to keep religion out of the game is political correctness or real life religions not having any effect on gameplay or the world so no reason to include them. InXile certainly doesn't need to avoid using real religions due to fear of retaliation or lawsuits.

EDIT: Speaking of lawsuits, I think Scientology should also be in the game. They are primarily based in southern California and I think writing them a ridiculous future would be very satisfying.

Scientologists were already in Fallout 2. They were in San Francisco and called Hubonites.

Ahead of its time really. Not that you couldn't include them in this game as well.

Hubonites?, werent they called Hubologist, or did i miss something this whole time?

[zlives]

why the big 3 didnt make it...

Jews, because the world ended and Hell.. you are living in it.
Christians, because the world ended and Jesus is a no show
Muslims, because the world ended and where are my 70 virgins

[Woolfe]

why the big 3 didnt make it...

Jews, because the world ended and Hell.. you are living in it.
Christians, because the world ended and Jesus is a no show
Muslims, because the world ended and where are my 70 virgins

Judaism is actually number 6.
Behind Hinduism, Buddhism and Sikhism.

I hadn't realised Bahaism was number 7 tho

[Inspector71]

This may be my naivety, but I don't think world religions would take a video game so seriously to go to court. I can see religious organizations being upset and decrying a product that they do not like how they are represented but legal action just seems like overreach. If they did attempt to sue, I doubt a judge would hear it. That case would be tossed out. Regarding lawsuits further, what exactly would they be suing over? Slander? Would an artist's interpretation of a possible future of an organization be some kind of defamation? I think you are thinking about it too deeply and I think fictional works and their artists have more freedom of expression than that.

Yes organized religions may get angry, but the only reason to keep religion out of the game is political correctness or real life religions not having any effect on gameplay or the world so no reason to include them. InXile certainly doesn't need to avoid using real religions due to fear of retaliation or lawsuits.

EDIT: Speaking of lawsuits, I think Scientology should also be in the game. They are primarily based in southern California and I think writing them a ridiculous future would be very satisfying.

Scientologists were already in Fallout 2. They were in San Francisco and called Hubonites.

Ahead of its time really. Not that you couldn't include them in this game as well.

Hubonites?, werent they called Hubologist, or did i miss something this whole time?

No you didn't miss anything. Both terms are used to refer to them in the game.

[wizaard]

I'd be satisfied if there were simply characters in the world with religious convictions (from real traditions or otherwise) who weren't depicted as psychopathic, signs of the apocalypse nut-jobs.

[Woolfe]

I'd be satisfied if there were simply characters in the world with religious convictions (from real traditions or otherwise) who weren't depicted as psychopathic, signs of the apocalypse nut-jobs.

Agreed... I know a lot of people who have strong religious beliefs, but are generally not nut-jobs.

[Clawdius]

I think a random encounter with a desert wanderer named Eli, wielding a machete would be enough religion for me. Yep, insanely high melee skill, ridiculous dodge skill... And of course just standard clothing and machete if you manage to kill him.

[Drool]

I'd be satisfied if there were simply characters in the world with religious convictions (from real traditions or otherwise) who weren't depicted as psychopathic, signs of the apocalypse nut-jobs.

Well, in the original, the religions were weird, but they weren't all kooks. Spam Shade mentioned the Bloodstaff being used to heal, Charmine lead a cult, but she wasn't a nut. The Bishop in Needles was a good man, too.

[clippedwolf]

why the big 3 didnt make it...

Jews, because the world ended and Hell.. you are living in it.
Christians, because the world ended and Jesus is a no show
Muslims, because the world ended and where are my 70 virgins

Because it is better to avoid alienating people with ignorant and inane examples. Anti-sematism, Islamaphobia, and anti-Christian sentiment can be side-stepped, even if you want to make any serious criticism of religions.
"But, C-Wolf", you say, "I think divorcing real world religions with my ideal in-game criticism waters down the impact. And besides, I like engaging in social masturbation by surrounding myself with like-minded individuals or feeding my ego with imagined power derived from pissing off people across the net."
I say, it may be possible to satirize aspects of the religion without directly insulting its followers. We should try to respect each other as individuals even as we disagreeing about fundamentals about existence and reality. Practicing unconditional positive regard (or universal love) has physiological and psychological benefits (and arguably better for our soul) -- even though this is nearly impossible to do at all times. We are only human.

[wizaard]

I'd be satisfied if there were simply characters in the world with religious convictions (from real traditions or otherwise) who weren't depicted as psychopathic, signs of the apocalypse nut-jobs.

Well, in the original, the religions were weird, but they weren't all kooks. Spam Shade mentioned the Bloodstaff being used to heal, Charmine lead a cult, but she wasn't a nut. The Bishop in Needles was a good man, too.

Thanks for those reminders. Confession: It's been so long since I played the original I've forgotten many details.