Hobo signs

[Ratboy]

Just curious if a crude language / spray painting language could be/ would be implemented to indicate simple things in the game.

Travelers with the means to communicate effectively would use signs to indicate trouble ahead, etch things into trees, rocks, etc.

If this could be implemented in a simple manner, or not at all, just an idea I'm throwing out. Rangers traveling a dangerous area might be able to use similar symbols to warn passers of danger using simple markings on walls, the ground ( inside ), etc.

Curiously enough, there is a link here :

http://preparedcitizenwsg.blogspot.ca/2 ... vival.html

[Valdevia]

This suggestion is so much win.
I loved the thieve's marks in skyrim (that told you if the house was safe, easy to rob, if there were shortcuts...)
Also, it's not a difficult addition to the game, so it won't bother a lot the developers. In addition, it would help a lot people who's stuck in a level (just have to try to find some of these!).
The "hobo language" (or whatever it's called) should be learned on a specific point of the game, like at the end of a secondary mission in which you helped a hobo with something.

EDIT: Oh and Ratboy, you should make a Google Idea moderator and link it here, see what people thinks.

[Drool]

Hobo signs in general are a pretty neat thing and would certainly fit in. Ranger-made signs would be less likely. In the Vegas area, the Rangers are largely in control, so signs would be unnecessary. In California, Rangers are a non-entity, so there wouldn't be any signs (unless we're following a lost team or something). Still signs left by locals could be neat, once you figured them out (hello, Cryptology).

If done, however, I hope they're done better than the Shadow Marks in Skyrim. They were neat, but kind of half-assed. Gee, this store is a good place to rob. Wow! Huh, the Companions' long house is a dangerous place. Shocking! Where they would actually be useful (outside of cities) they simply weren't there. And since there was no backlash for robbing "protected" houses, there was really little point in them.

[Son of Max]

Anything that would actually make Cryptology a useful skill is welcome in my book.

[MinscAndBoo]

Make hobo signs better by leading you into a trap, displaying out of date information. or letting the A.I Change it around to confuse you.

Failing Cryptology / Perception checks means you would have to work out how much of that Sign is truthful by surveying the area.

One of the greatest tools at the NPC's / A.I's / designers disposal is miss-information.

[Valka]

I like the idea in most any way it could be implemented. Personally I've had a long time admiration of the idea of "message sticks". They are used by indigenous Australians, but I've seen documentary reports of types of them in other societies. The evolution of something akin to this would be fun.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Message_stick

[Valdevia]

If done, however, I hope they're done better than the Shadow Marks in Skyrim. They were neat, but kind of half-assed. Gee, this store is a good place to rob. Wow! Huh, the Companions' long house is a dangerous place. Shocking! Where they would actually be useful (outside of cities) they simply weren't there. And since there was no backlash for robbing "protected" houses, there was really little point in them.

True. I'm not saying they should make exactly that though. I mean using hidden marks in the corners of the buildings, saying if the owner of the house had a dangerous dog, if there is drinkable water near, or if the Guardians have a base around the area. That kind of useful things, not if a shop is a good place to rob

Make hobo signs better by leading you into a trap, displaying out of date information. or letting the A.I Change it around to confuse you.

Failing Cryptology / Perception checks means you would have to work out how much of that Sign is truthful by surveying the area.

One of the greatest tools at the NPC's / A.I's / designers disposal is miss-information.

I think that's too much for the developers. Also, miss-informing people would lead to everyone running in circles looking for that "dangerous dog".
If this was made, the "trap marks" could be very damaged, so people can notice it's an old sign and may not be right.

[Ratboy]

Wasn't expecting a lot of interest, but happy to see it.

I would think hobo signs or tags would be more prevalent in rail areas, but a form of signs used by rangers / locals / tribes / etc. interested me.

I'll pop up a Google moderator topic :

EDIT : http://goo.gl/mod/khwi




When hiking, there's usually flags or other markings to indicate the trail, using little things like this might make areas more interesting.

[suz]

Your link goes to someplace else for me, this is probably your vote

[Ratboy]

Your link goes to someplace else for me, this is probably your vote

Fixed the link. Thanks.

I don't want the implementation from Skyrim either. Too easy.

If implemented, signs specific to factions could be implemented such as The Desert Rangers, slavers, traders, etc.

They shouldn't be terribly obvious, but something that could be crudely fashioned using charcoal, rocks in a formation, bullet holes in a stop sign, etc.

[Sub-Human]

They shouldn't be terribly obvious...

Exactly. I remember, a fairly stupid thing in Far Cry 2 was how you had a sign saying 'Safehouse'. Lol, what? How 'safe' is it gonna be if everyone can see it?

Perhaps if your Rangers have learned that this sign points to that location (i.e. a bum on the street says that two sticks crossed together means religious cult hideout), one of the Rangers could actually have floating text saying 'Looks like we found what we were looking for!' the first time you witness it (unless your party's been there prior to the information).

[MinscAndBoo]

If done, however, I hope they're done better than the Shadow Marks in Skyrim. They were
...snip...

Make hobo signs better by leading you into a trap, displaying out of date information. or letting the A.I Change it around to confuse you.

Failing Cryptology / Perception checks means you would have to work out how much of that Sign is truthful by surveying the area.

One of the greatest tools at the NPC's / A.I's / designers disposal is miss-information.

...snip

Ahhhh I wrote "Make hobo signs better ...." not Son of Max

Also, I wouldn't say hobo signs should all be misleading. On the contrary they should be part of the package that a quest maker makes. For example, any quest requires x amount of elements, and a hobo sign will just be one element. Whether it is a positive or negative element is up to the quest maker.

[rakenan]

I think that's too much for the developers. Also, miss-informing people would lead to everyone running in circles looking for that "dangerous dog".
If this was made, the "trap marks" could be very damaged, so people can notice it's an old sign and may not be right.

If the signs are not going to be reliable, people will just ignore them - why follow a sign that is no better than random guessing, when you can randomly guess without caring about the sign at all? Instead of paying attention to in-game signs, people will go to walkthroughs and FAQs.

If wrong or intentionally misleading signs of this sort are put in place, they need to be very carefully handled to avoid making the whole sign system a complete waste of developer effort.

[MinscAndBoo]

In world war II and probably I, street signs were rubbed out and changed around to confuse an advancing enemy.

Why would it be any different in the wasteland universe?

I do agree that making every sign misleading is not helping immersion. Like in towns and established areas.

But at the same time, X does not and should not mark the spot.

Let player skill* determine the usefulness of a hobo sign.

*Perception/Cryptology checks. Success = "Speech bubble - The signs been tampered with, so we should go east" Failure = "Speech bubble - The sign says go south, OK lets go"

Even a negative hobo sign can be an indicator that something important is near by. It's as much a deterrent as it is an attraction.

[Drool]

In world war II and probably I, street signs were rubbed out and changed around to confuse an advancing enemy.

But we're not talking about street signs, we're talking about hobo signs. False or misleading signs go against the entire point of the exercise. The point of them is to help people you are (nominally) allied with. They're small signs that someone would likely overlook unless they knew what to look for, and find largely useless unless they knew how to read them.

[Lucius]

I wouldn't see why any signs made by the average wastelander would be misleading. Why would they be? I could see a group or gang using signage to steer travelers into traps and ambushes they have setup. But I wouldn't see that happening more than once or twice in the whole game.

[MinscAndBoo]

In world war II and probably I, street signs were rubbed out and changed around to confuse an advancing enemy.

But we're not talking about street signs, we're talking about hobo signs. False or misleading signs go against the entire point of the exercise. The point of them is to help people you are (nominally) allied with. They're small signs that someone would likely overlook unless they knew what to look for, and find largely useless unless they knew how to read them.

I'm talking about the psychology behind them.

I would not write a sign, hobo or otherwise, leading _anyone_ directly into my camp.

[Drool]

I'm talking about the psychology behind them.

I would not write a sign, hobo or otherwise, leading _anyone_ directly into my camp.

Generally speaking, that's not what hobo signs did. They tended to give information about the specific place where they were inscribed. "This house has a friendly family." "The cops here are mean." "This place has a guard dog." Stuff like that.

[MinscAndBoo]

I'm talking about the psychology behind them.

I would not write a sign, hobo or otherwise, leading _anyone_ directly into my camp.

Generally speaking, that's not what hobo signs did. They tended to give information about the specific place where they were inscribed. "This house has a friendly family." "The cops here are mean." "This place has a guard dog." Stuff like that.

I understand what your saying. But Is it believable in post-apocalyptic kill-or-be-killed wasteland?

[suz]

I understand what your saying. But Is it believable in post-apocalyptic kill-or-be-killed wasteland?

Why not? It's not like post apocalyptic means everyone's suddenly turned into dicks.
People literally risked their necks to save people they're not related to in any way in the holocaust, what makes you think there won't be any good willed people who give others advice?