Mood: Fallout vs Wasteland

[Brother None]

We're going to see Fallout influence seep into Wasteland quite a lot, inevitably. But it's easy to forget the games were pretty dissimilar in many ways.

Mood is one of the key ways the two diverge. Fallout was played relatively more straight, though there was still a lot of dark humor. Wasteland, by comparison, worked with brighter colors, a more varied desert, and a lighter tone.

This is one part of the game where I'm a little wary of Fallout influencing it too much. Do we really want a wasteland with the brown/grey look of the dead deserts of Fallout? We all remember the Cochise base (and those robots tearing us up). You could say Fallout 2 (and maybe 3) played it a lot closer to the way Wasteland did it, but I for one feel this is a unique side of Wasteland where you should not look to emulate Fallout. It's good for the two settings to be strongly different.

[Bill]

This is one part of the game where I'm a little wary of Fallout influencing it too much.

I'm totally with you on this one dude, it'd be a damn shame to see it happen as well.

That goes double for the modern *ahem* interpretations of the Fallout franchise.

[TellarHK]

I don't see a problem with Fallout's mood and maturity level, but then I've also never been the kind of person to find variations in that kind of approach to be a bad thing. My biggest problem with Fallout 1-2 was the engine limitations, and my largest problem with Fallout 3/New Vegas was the engine bugs. Otherwise, I think they did an amazing job with the game. Fallout: New Vegas in particular had a really appealing style to it, and the references to Wasteland were nice and thick in the Old World Blues DLC.

Even the paint job on the Roboscorpions was correct.

The biggest thing to keep in mind in a Fallout vs. Wasteland comparison is that Wasteland just needs to have its own distinct "feel" from Fallout, and the specifics of that difference are what I'm sure the team plotting the game now are already spending the most time on.

[Sharkyzero]

Yeah, some of these kinda responses scare me a bit (I feel like this is my only chance to ever play a true to form "Fallout 3"). I want a similar experience to Fallout 2. BUT...I want to know what Wasteland is and, if it's so different, why people wouldn't want a tremendous amount of Fallout inspiration.

I <3 Fallout. Good lord, did I love that game (1 & 2). I'm clearly going to be wishing for a Fallout-y experience. But I'm open to a new story big time especially if the RPG elements are there and it's got quite a bit of the same type of gameplay that I grew up with and fell hard for in Fallout (2 especially, not so much Fallout Tactics, however)

[Socioistic]

I think Wasteland 2 should be what Wasteland was, and the idea that Interplay instill in Fallout 1 and 2. I have yet to find a way to legally get a copy of Wasteland, so I haven't played it. But I have already played the first Fallout twice, and am on my way to beating Fallout 2, after which I play to get the cut content patch, and play through again. What I have loved about the games so far is they made you think, and actually consider things.

I like the fact that the games didn't lead you by the hand like every game does this way; in Fallout 3 and NV, you just follow the arrow, and shoot red marker blips on your radar, and before you know it, your dad's dead, the Vegas is screwed, and the games is over. Without the use of our modern Wiki to tell us how to complete every quest, players would have to actually talk to people to get clues, and look around for stuff, and maybe even (God forbid), make decisions on what to do. You even had to fight smart to an extent, if you had the difficulty on normal or higher. I want that back.

Another thing I want to address is the maturity, and overall mood of the game. So far, Fallout 2 is on my top five favourite games ever because it had some feel of realism to it. You could kill children, pay hookers for some alone time, get people drunk, even be a part of gangs, and directly involve yourself with major drug trade, and overall do just whatever you wanted. I love what Bethesda did for the series, but they took a series that was filled with dark humor that Interplay seems to have prided itself on, and simple, easily overlooked things that made it feel more genuine (like the fact that guns were made by real companies, and weren't just "10mm pistol", and "assault rifle") and replaced that with a lot of crappy dialogue, silly jokes, ping-ponging quests, and trite, childish notions of a black and white world view.

The mood of Wasteland 2 should be something gripping. Something that is fun to play, easy to immerse yourself in, and full of shoes that are hard to see yourself being in.

[TwinkieGorilla]

Yeah, some of these kinda responses scare me a bit

It shouldn't.

I don't think BN is asking for a game void of Fallout influence (whether that's something avoidable or not at this point is a whole other topic) but instead suggesting Wasteland could stand to lose a lot by forgetting what made it memorable in the first place. And I totally agree.

The color scheme is a tricky one though. It could be pulled off...but those colors aren't exactly friendly to a modern palate. Would be nice to see some mock-ups.

[ThatDearGuy]

Nice to see you here, Brother None. (Tricky / GameBanshee)

I think *any* game can be a lesson for later games to come, Fallout included. This naturally goes for any kind of aspect, including mood and gameplay. That the most modern games often still forget to pay attention to the older lessons learned from classic games (Baldur's Gate really springs to mind here) is something can really bother me. Especially when you're creating a sequel to such an old game, it's a mistake you can't really afford to make.

I personally do want to see something more mature and realistic than Fallout. That being said, the Fallout series had a few good points.

[hiptanaka]

I didn't play Wasteland back in the day, so I'm naturally happy with the Fallout mood, but I would be OK with a lighter, more playful tone, as long as it's not too goofy to keep me from getting into the world/story.

I guess what's more important to me is that locations and character motivations make sense, within the logic of the game world, and that it touches some "serious" themes.

[Tern]

It's good for the two settings to be strongly different.

Definitely agree with you there.
They're different and should be treated as such. Otherwise we might well end up with something closer to a Fallout spinoff than a Sequel to Wasteland.

[Brother None]

Yeah, some of these kinda responses scare me a bit (I feel like this is my only chance to ever play a true to form "Fallout 3"). I want a similar experience to Fallout 2.

Well, it's certainly closer to Fallout 2 than Fallout.

But it's this that "scares" me. This is the next Wasteland, not Fallout 3. I love Fallout, and would dearly have loved to have seen a Fallout 3 closer to the originals, but Wasteland 2 shouldn't be there to replace it, other than in being a post-apocalyptic old-school RPG.

[ThatDearGuy]

Yeah, some of these kinda responses scare me a bit (I feel like this is my only chance to ever play a true to form "Fallout 3"). I want a similar experience to Fallout 2.

Well, it's certainly closer to Fallout 2 than Fallout.

But it's this that "scares" me. This is the next Wasteland, not Fallout 3. I love Fallout, and would dearly have loved to have seen a Fallout 3 closer to the originals, but Wasteland 2 shouldn't be there to replace it, other than in being a post-apocalyptic old-school RPG.

If Wasteland 2 was finished today, what would be the first title the reviewing sites are going to compare this game to? Borderlands?

The comparison is inevitable. What is important to consider is in what ways Wasteland 2 can at least be better than any Fallout game.

[Brother None]

I don't care about the comparison. Comparisons are fine, as are inspirations. But this game shouldn't be *confused* with filling the gap Fallout left. It's got different gameplay ideas, primarily in being party-based rather than lone wanderer, and a very different setting.

[bpstrat]

I also feel that the Wasteland franchise needs to be distinct from the Fallout franchise. I always felt that Wasteland had an 80's vibe to it, with the colors and technology and all of that. The military aspects also felt inspired by 80's action movies, like Mad Max, Terminator, and Commando and so on. The Fallout games have the 50's retro feel, of course, along with the idealized, yet cynical view of American life. I love both of these settings, but please keep them separate!

[Ausir]

I don't care about the comparison. Comparisons are fine, as are inspirations. But this game shouldn't be *confused* with filling the gap Fallout left. It's got different gameplay ideas, primarily in being party-based rather than lone wanderer, and a very different setting.

Well, I think a large part of the target audience will be fans of Fallout 1 and 2 who were not happy with Fallout 3. And that's fine. But I also don't think inXile should simply copy Fallout's setting and mood.

[Snake Vargas]

There's going to be a fallout 4 eventually right? Let fallout be fallout & wasteland be wasteland.

Not that color is a game maker or breaker for me, but if it is going to be reminiscent of wasteland it needs a comparable mood. I realize however that many people drawn to this project are hoping for the fallout influence mixed into Wasteland's truer RPG elements. There are going to be some tough calls to make for the devs but personnally I stand with BN on this one.

[stefix]

To sum it up IMO a Grindhouse style for W2 will be in order, exaggeration an absurdity is what i would expect from a postapocalyptic world/story/atmosphere.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grindhouse

[TwinkieGorilla]

There's going to be a fallout 4 eventually right?

Depends on your point of view.

[rokahef]

It's good for the two settings to be strongly different.

Definitely agree with you there.
They're different and should be treated as such. Otherwise we might well end up with something closer to a Fallout spinoff than a Sequel to Wasteland.

Agreed - if you read the 'top-down vs. isometric' thread, it seems like half the people here are clamoring for a sequel to Fallout 2.

Which i would love to see, don't get me wrong. But that's a different game, and Wasteland 2 should follow on from Wasteland 1, not Fallout.

[Sobboth]

Wasteland 2 should follow on from Wasteland 1, not Fallout.

+1 and it must surprise me.

[TailSwallower]

1. I have never played Wasteland (the graphics and UI were too far gone by the time I tried it out)
2. I would murder for Van Buren to be finished and released.
3. Despite the above, I still completely agree with Brother None.

I don't want to play a Wasteland game that wishes it was Fallout, I want Wasteland 2 to show me why people loved the original so much and to build on from there.