Rangers ,essential or not?

[kasra5004]

Through out the board I have seen words like "rangers HQ","ranger center" and ... So many times. I know rangers are a part of wasteland's identity,but should the player be forced to be a ranger? Or at least let him choose what he wants to be. Personally I like the idea of no strings attached.

I think if the player wants to be a raider,a ganger or even a lone wolf, he should have the choice.He may even want to fight the rangers, again its his choice. What do you think?

[paultakeda]

That would depend on the story Brian and company want to tell. If the story of Wasteland is about the rangers as a group, then that's that. The success of WL2 could then lead to spin-offs where focus can be changed, such as creating a single PC with NPC recruits game a la Fallout or even an, gasp, action-RPG as cinematically inclined as Mass Effect 3.

My opinion is that rangers are central to the Wasteland plot, so I guess for me it's essential.

[krellen]

I think if the player wants to be a raider,a ganger or even a lone wolf, he should have the choice.He may even want to fight the rangers, again its his choice. What do you think?

It's a lot of work to write a separate story for each potential faction. Instead of getting one massive Ranger-based story, we'd instead have to have four smaller stories, one for Rangers, one for gangers, one for raiders, and one for loners.

Besides that, being a Ranger is just an iconic part of Wasteland. The whole story is based off the idea that you are Rangers, with orders to investigate the troubles in the area and put them right.

Also, the player won't be playing just one character, so "lone wolf" wouldn't really be appropriate.

[Vryheid]

Through out the board I have seen words like "rangers HQ","ranger center" and ... So many times. I know rangers are a part of wasteland's identity,but should the player be forced to be a ranger? Or at least let him choose what he wants to be. Personally I like the idea of no strings attached.

I think if the player wants to be a raider,a ganger or even a lone wolf, he should have the choice.He may even want to fight the rangers, again its his choice. What do you think?

Well, I might want to play a Dark Arts master in a Harry Potter game, but that wouldn't make for a very coherent story now would it?

[PiPboy]

Its to continue with the story line.
Just like all the fallout series has to do with something related to the vault and PiPBoy [No relation]

and all Mass Effect has to deal with how Commander Sheppard likes to beat up alien spieces that likes to take over the universe.

Being a ranger is part of the consistency of the story. There is nothing to say he doesn't or "can't" join the dark side [Dues ex]

[Celtic927]

I think RANGERS is the way to go...Fallout was a Vault Dweller three out of Five of the games....This is only part 2 in WL saga lets stick with the formula before we deviate from it

[kasra5004]

Its to continue with the story line. Just like all the fallout series has to do with something related to the vault and PiPBoy [No relation]

and all Mass Effect has to deal with how Commander Sheppard likes to beat up alien spieces that likes to take over the universe.

Being a ranger is part of the consistency of the story. There is nothing to say he doesn't o thr "can't" join the dark side [Dues ex]

But I think rangers as an organized military force, must have some kind of fixed set of rules and idealogy, the leadership can't respond to the player's bad or good path the same. At the very least there should be some kind of punishment. I'm not saying rangers should be ommitted, but some other factions should be playable if the gamer wants to.It doesn't make sense to be a bandit and a ranger at the same time.

Plus, as I'm sure many agree with me, one of the mosr irritating things about mass effect, or DA and many other rpg games is that they force the player to take a specific side and make choices he doesn't like. They have been heavily criticized for that, even in this board! This way wl2 which claims to revive effective decision making in the rpg genre,will give less options in factions than say newvegas.

[paultakeda]

Plus, as I'm sure many agree with me, one of the mosr irritating things about mass effect, or DA and many other rpg games is that they force the player to take a specific side and make choices he doesn't like. They have been heavily criticized for that, even in this board! This way wl2 which claims to revive effective decision making in the rpg genre,will give less options in factions than say newvegas.

The only thing you can say about the rangers is that they are there to establish what they perceive to be law and order. Seeing as there is no good or bad inherent in law and/or order, the game will allow for a lot of interpretation even with a ranger-based storyline.

[krellen]

must have some kind of fixed set of rules and idealogy

Whatever the Ranger's rules and ideology is, it's varied enough to allow those that wantonly murder a town full of children and those that rescue a little girl from a cave-in to coexist.

[vadersson]

I personally would like us to be Rangers and continue the Ranger tradition and back story from Wasteland one. That is something I missed in Fallout. Rangers have a reputation (which, perhaps your actions should color through the game. i.e. if you are mean, then the Rangers are considered to be jerks as you go on.)

Just thinking here.

Thanks,
Duncan

[Mort2]

Through out the board I have seen words like "rangers HQ","ranger center" and ... So many times. I know rangers are a part of wasteland's identity,but should the player be forced to be a ranger? Or at least let him choose what he wants to be. Personally I like the idea of no strings attached.

I think if the player wants to be a raider,a ganger or even a lone wolf, he should have the choice.He may even want to fight the rangers, again its his choice. What do you think?

Essential or not iirc Fargo already stated that we will start with a group of reagers.

[BlackGauntlet]

And rangers we will be.

What's wrong with being one? It certainly didn't make WL1 any less fun to play.

Imagine, I had to play as: "Jedi Knight", "General", "RingFellow", "Chosen One", "Savior", "The Hero" and whatnot without the chance to say nuh-uh a single time. So, controlling a group of people from a faction whose ideal is... up to you to decide, is no less non-linear than any other CRPGs out there.

[Tanglebones]

Rangers are iconic to Wasteland (and I think including the Rangers is also an important way to distinguish WL2 from Fallout), I couldn't see WL2 being a Wasteland game without the Rangers. But as numerous people have already pointed out, in the original, the Rangers weren't held up to any kind of a code imposed by the game. You were free to play your Rangers as upright (and uptight?) do-gooders, or the deliverers of some frontier justice, or as people who just wanted to see the Wastes purged in fire and blood. Well. I guess you couldn't finish the game with that last mindset, since your eventual goal was to prevent a robot apocalypse... but... you were free to kill almost everyone in the world. If you wanted.

Anyway, the point is that being a Ranger doesn't have to limit your moral choices any more than being a Vault Dweller or a Tribal did in Fallout 1&2.

[BlackGauntlet]

Aye. Anymore freedom given, Brian would have to release the game as a Pen-&-Paper RPG Rulebook.

[Azriel]

I like the idea of no strings attached method myself, like the game starts you off with rangers trying to recruit you, but you have the choice to decline, or how about the option to quit being a ranger? I understand the first game had you start off as a ranger, but it does not have to be tradition, even the fallout games changed the origin stories of the character. Fallout was the vault dweller, the second was the descendent of the vault dweller and his tribe, the third went back to a vault, and fallout new vegas had you start off as courier. Why not start off with something new with the OPTION to becoming a ranger?

[The_A_Drain]

Actually what might not be a bad idea (although even as someone who is only playing Wasteland for the first time now, not sure if it would suit W2 or not) is an 'origin' story ala Dragon Age: Origins, it was one of the things I felt that game really got right, so you could have like a separate hour or so for each backstory that all converge to the same rough beginning point for the main game.

Something like as was mentioned earlier, Ranger, Ganger/Raider, Villager(or Tribal or whatever fits), etc.

[Gizmo]

IMO it seems that RPGs that praise and strive for absolute freedom for freedom sake... turn out to be sandbox-simulators with little or no structured story ~and I usually don't care for them that much... Where as RPGs that strive for a good story ~usually at the expense of absolute freedom, [IMO] tend to have a more coherent and more enjoyable narrative.

I'm usually looking for an interesting character 'seed', and a good tale that they are wrapped up in ~over just a reactive world with the freedom to invent any PC I wish. This is not always the case ~it depends on the scope of the PRG, but I seem to always prefer a tailored campaign over a "find-as-you-go" McVenture. I would not have like Baldur's Gate as much if it was just that you leave Candle Keep and aimlessly wander the land with no Saravok or Bhal storyline (IE. no immutable history); just wandering Faerun as a Cleric, mage, fighter or thief.

I would expect a Wasteland sequel to be about Rangers regardless of who they are personality-wise.
The game should be about Rangers, in the same way that Jagged Alliance' sequel is about mercenaries and not botanists. (I might not be opposed to the option of Ex-Ranger, but I think it's not for the best).

[Mikipoo]

In wasteland, at least in my play experience, you were always rangers. Every character you created was a ranger. This worked fine, but since the ability for the game is so much more expansive, why not have different starting backgrounds and positions?

Say, a group raised in a Tribal Camp? A group born/enslaved and recruited into a Raider gang? A group that grew up in a city slum?

This expands re-playability, and certainly would alter the way you would complete the final objective (whatever it may be) of the game. Do you destroy the 'big baddie', depose him/her/it/them and take it's place? etc.

[Leona]

Actually what might not be a bad idea (although even as someone who is only playing Wasteland for the first time now, not sure if it would suit W2 or not) is an 'origin' story ala Dragon Age: Origins, it was one of the things I felt that game really got right, so you could have like a separate hour or so for each backstory that all converge to the same rough beginning point for the main game.

Something like as was mentioned earlier, Ranger, Ganger/Raider, Villager(or Tribal or whatever fits), etc.

I second that, it will be more fun to earn your way in to a ranger organization. Then when you part of rangers org and earning ranks you get to pick your self a team mates, player can recruit from ranger center but recruits thre will be with very low stats or you can recruit from missions some people who you see as unique addition to your team but you have to earn their trust. Those character will be good addition to your team compared to newbie recruit from ranger center. But each one in the beginning will have their own agenda.

I personally would like us to be Rangers and continue the Ranger tradition and back story from Wasteland one. That is something I missed in Fallout. Rangers have a reputation (which, perhaps your actions should color through the game. i.e. if you are mean, then the Rangers are considered to be jerks as you go on.)

Great point.

EDIT: DO NOT DOUBLE POST -BN

[paultakeda]

I second that, it will be more fun to earn your way in to a ranger organization. Then when you part of rangers org and earning ranks you get to pick your self a team mates

Not going to happen. That's a main character (i.e. "Chosen One") RPG, which is not what Wasteland 2 is going to be. A Wasteland spinoff, say WL:Lone Ranger, can do this. But let WL2 get made first as a sequel to WL1 and not turn it into a Dragons Age 2, okay?