Mood: Fallout vs Wasteland

[krellen]

New Vegas was no Fallout game, period.

Leave now, and never come back.

[Keaton]

Very convincing!

My definition of Fallout:
POSTAPOCALYPTIC setting with anarchic game world (like it is supposed to be in that setting) and therefore no countries or political conflicts influencing every fucking ingame situation but instead kind of a violent, gritty, dark humored Mad Max theme park design like in Wasteland, Fallout and Fallout 2 (maybe slightly less pop culture humor than in Fallout 2 if you prefer part 1).
That makes Fallout 3 indefinitely more true to the spirit of Fallout than New Vegas which turned the whole post nuclear setting upside down. But as I wrote Fallout 3 is still shit because of the bad writing.

and now you again:
OMG! RETARDED!!!
(insert random 4chan style picture here)

p.s.:
I don't give a shit about your feelings or opinion or whatever, krellen. If you don't just want to invoke the hive mind to cast out the heretic (RPG Codex style) then just cut the crap and try to find convincing arguments for whatever you want to say. Else I just don't care about your bullshit.

[Takamorisan]

Even if I didn't play wasteland.
I don't think that fallout color pallet and art style would fit for wasteland 2, need to create a distinction between the games in that department.

No dark humor , more serious stuff like wasteland 1( done some reading),a tragic post apoc setting.
Actually that shock the players in their decision etc etc.

[Lanatir]

Umm.. I think Wasteland actually had more, and also better humor than Fallout did. The Paragraph book alone contained more funny stuff than all Fallout games combined.

[Son of Max]

We're going to see Fallout influence seep into Wasteland quite a lot, inevitably. But it's easy to forget the games were pretty dissimilar in many ways.

Mood is one of the key ways the two diverge. Fallout was played relatively more straight, though there was still a lot of dark humor. Wasteland, by comparison, worked with brighter colors, a more varied desert, and a lighter tone.

This is one part of the game where I'm a little wary of Fallout influencing it too much. Do we really want a wasteland with the brown/grey look of the dead deserts of Fallout? We all remember the Cochise base (and those robots tearing us up). You could say Fallout 2 (and maybe 3) played it a lot closer to the way Wasteland did it, but I for one feel this is a unique side of Wasteland where you should not look to emulate Fallout. It's good for the two settings to be strongly different.

Agreed.

[Delicieuxz]

Wasteland 2 should definitely present itself as the sequel to Wasteland, and not Fallout. Colour and variety are to be on order in the scenery landscape, while Fallout's bland monotonous pallet is not. Post-apocalyptic means to me post-apocalyptic... which denotes a destruction of civilization, and means nothing in regards to what foliage has grown in the meantime. It actually suggests that mother nature has taken back some of its territory. It doesn't take long after a bomb for foliage to regrow (Wasteland's setting wasn't a ground zero anyway, so scorched lands don't even make sense - additionally, there are a lot of valleys, where the foliage would be shielded from explosions), and Wasteland 2's timeline is, regardless, well beyond the necessary period to have a full landscape. People shouldn't make the mistake of expecting Wasteland 2 to be Fallout spawn.

[Emmy Lou]

As someone who came into this Kickstarter not even knowing what Wasteland was but having been a Fallout fan for over half my life, I'm definitely not opposed to Wasteland being it's own beast. Would I mind if WL2 bent more towards Fallout's grittier, dark humour and colour palette? Of course not! I quite enjoy that type of post-apocalypse! It's part of the appeal of wandering a world that's been blown up.

Would I mind if WL2 stays truer to the original's out-there humour and 80s/DOSy palette? Not in the least! Part of the fun of playing a new RPG is exploring a world you don't know and getting lost in the story the creator wants to tell within it. I'm not against WL being it's own world at all, even if I like to Razz the fogeys of these forums about it

I suspect the final product will be somewhere in the middle. After all, the very first concept we saw of this game I would say leans much closer toward Fallout gritty than WL wacky.

While the "Look and feel" of the game may take a nosedive for the realistic if this art is any indication, that's not saying the mood and spirit of the original won't make a return

[paultakeda]

After all, the very first concept we saw of this game I would say leans much closer toward Fallout gritty than WL wacky.

What you're not seeing is that they are staring in awe at the dude in a bunny outfit, surrounded by twenty-foot stalks of broccoli.

[Emmy Lou]

[Solomize]

To some extend, Fallout has been Wasteland (and Bad Blood) brought to some maturity step. Not intellectulaly, but considering technologies and what Interplay thought would be a good setting. I am not sure they should be seen as competing.

Giant pink broccoli, why not ? Fallout had some, in other forms. The question may be : should the game be a comedy ? Weird War 2 (if you know the game) ? should it take itself (too) seriously ? Should Wasteland 2 be a War of the Worlds parody ? Fun fact is, InXile already knows what it is going to be. I am confident. The 50s belong to Fallout and Wasteland 2 is definitely going to have an other personnality. With what has been learned from Fallout nonetheless, up a step.

[Emmy Lou]

This quote direct from Brian in the Reddit

We don't mind the questions at all and especially in light of it being fan funded. Sometimes we don't have all the answers as we are still polling the forums to nail down the main sensibilities.. though most of them are well known now. We are going to take the universe of Wasteland serious and not parody or joke about it. But there will be twisted humor that will spring forth and not every scenario will be dead serious. Modern day police cover a number of crimes than range from murder to more domestic issues. There will be a heavy mood that is accomplished with the music of Mark Morgan, the visuals and the writing. Expect a somewhat dense narrative as the literary vibe is what made many of those old school games hum.

Seems to suggest that the tone will in fact be a tad more gritty and dark than the original seemed to be. Of course, the second piece of concept art we've seen has been the dreaded Scorpitron I've heard so much about, so we also know there will be a strong possibility that many of the other out-there features that made Wasteland be "Wasteland" aren't ruled out by a long shot

I hope those Cyborgcycles return as well, those sound awesome!

[Lucius]

I hope those Cyborgcycles return as well, those sound awesome!

I second this. I really liked those guys. Maybe it's just because they were one of the easier enemies to face in the Vegas sewers.

[Infinitron]

My definition of Fallout:
POSTAPOCALYPTIC setting with anarchic game world (like it is supposed to be in that setting) and therefore no countries or political conflicts influencing every fucking ingame situation

Your definition of Fallout is wrong. Fallout 2 had "countries" and political conflict too. The series is as much about the rebuilding of society after the apocalypse as it is about the apocalypse itself.

[homeslice82]

A lot of Wasteland 2's direction has me excited. But this, in my opinion, threatens to undermine the entire deal:

We are going to take the universe of Wasteland serious and not parody or joke about it. But there will be twisted humor that will spring forth and not every scenario will be dead serious. Modern day police cover a number of crimes than range from murder to more domestic issues. There will be a heavy mood that is accomplished with the music of Mark Morgan, the visuals and the writing. Expect a somewhat dense narrative as the literary vibe is what made many of those old school games hum.

No. Brian is describing Fallout 1 here. Wasteland has hobo oracles, giant mutated vegatables, revolver-wielding babies, temples with WALLS MADE OF BLOOD, women who glow purple, armored rabbits, detectives named Spam Shade, goofy cannibalism, motorcycles with human heads, three-legged prostitutes, over-eager accordion players, and hundred-plus-year-old farmers. Unless it has a healthy dose of crazy, it is not Wasteland.

Including occasional "twisted humor" in a serious setting just makes this a repeat of Fallout--which might sound great to the people who signed up hoping that this would be Fallout 4. What about the people who are here because they want to see Wasteland reborn? Is it fair to bait them with the Wasteland IP and then deliver Fallout-with-a-different-name? Isn't that exactly the kind of move that publishers would make (and have made, repeatedly) these days? Not to say that the WL2 team is doing it on purpose--I just think they've forgotten that Wasteland 1 and Fallout were very different games. I hope that they remember before production starts.

[Keaton]

You have a point there but you know what?
I don't care as long as he makes a great turn and party based old school (...btw I'd like to have a definition of that term "old school", some older games are much more fun than newer ones but I still don't know if that's just nostalgia or if there really was more to it ... maybe it's just the party and turn based design, today you don't get those anymore) RPG in a postapocalyptic setting. Wasteland was indeed very goofy and I don't know if babies with revolvers would be still that great if you saw their heads explode in 3D.

[Mandemon]

Progression of recovery in Fallout:

Fallout 1: First settlements, mostly anarchy but civilization is starting rise again, even if it needs rifle to support itself. Life is hard.

Fallout 2: First nations are formed, NCR, former powerhouse fade away (Brotherhood of Steel for example, Hub losing it's importance to trade). Life outside these well established nations is hard, but nations themselves are doing well.

Haven't played Fallout 3, but appearently East Coast got hit harder and is still in Fallout 1 level.

Fallout: New Vegas has two new nations (NCR and Legion) coming to blow, one former powerhouse barely surviving (BoS) and new players trying to get rid both (Courier/House). Life is, in general, good inside nation or not. However, existing nations have slowly started to corrupt thanks to lack of struggle.

From what I have seen in Wasteland, Wasteland skips 1st stage and drops into Fallout 2 recovery.

[Shady314]

A lot of Wasteland 2's direction has me excited. But this, in my opinion, threatens to undermine the entire deal:

Yes but remember Fallout is what they made when they wanted to make WL2 but couldn't. I think it's a direction Brian has always wanted to go with Wasteland and I gave my money for him to make the game. Not anyone else. I'm one of those people that felt FO2 went too far with the gags and played F:NV without Wild Wasteland. Humor is fine but most of that stuff you mentions just takes me out of the story.

This is said in all seriousness and I am not being snarky or telling you to go away or anything like that. I believe WL2 will be more serious than you want. If that's a deal breaker you should remove your pledge and wait to see the finished product before buying.

[Drool]

Wasteland had plenty of goofy nonsense, like pulling fruit, visa cards, and electronic devices out of broken toasters.

But it also had more than its fair share of very serious stuff; it was just less memorable. But remember, there was the unexplained murders in Needles, the mayor's wife wired with a bomb in Quartz, a teenager kidnapped by the Guardians, a brutal turf war in Vegas, human experimentation in Darwin. And the whole robot army wanting to eradicate all life in the world.

Wasteland did a good job of juggling both aspects and making both of them work and feel at home with each other.

[GodComplex]

Whenever I see threads like this, I'm often reminded of the manga Berserk. Because in the middle of a bloody battle where people are being devoured by demons, others are being cut down like weeds, and the hero is about to go on a rage fueled team killing spree, there exists an elf holding up a sign that says "cogito ergo sum." It's completely out of place and a bit distracting, but it's suppose to be. I maintain that humor is civilization's way of coping with the horrors of reality. And it makes it less damaging mentally when we are able to wade through mountains of dead only to encounter a baby with a shotgun asking you if he fired 5 shots or 6, and if you feel lucky.

[Grotesque]

I never thought I will see the day when somebody complains because of a game that would be also a true successor to Fallout.
Personally, I don't want armored rabbits in this game but I don't care too much is a poll says otherwise.
At least be thankfull that you have a sequel made by Brian Fargo and others in the original team, something that Fallout fans will never have the pleasure.
You have 49 hours to remove the pledge if you feel so disappointed and carry on.
So long!