Machismo

[homeslice82]

Seriously. Just no. The game industry has been overloaded with that crap for more than a decade.

[Postapo]

I'm seariously intriqued what OP understands under the term.

Last decade was mostly a heap of shit, rpg-wise, but I never encountered machismo, hell, not even in the 90s.

If you mean some npcs being boisterous or condescending as intended by the designers, then I can't agree with you. But again: I can't find anything machismo-related in the politically correct pulp we've been served recently.

[homeslice82]

I'm seariously intriqued what OP understands under the term.

Last decade was mostly a heap of shit, rpg-wise, but I never encountered machismo, hell, not even in the 90s.

If you mean some npcs being boisterous or condescending as intended by the designers, then I can't agree with you. But again: I can't find anything machismo-related in the politically correct pulp we've been served recently.

[Tanglebones]

Why do we want to avoid machismo? I mean, I think that projecting an attitude like, "I'm one hard motherfucker," would be pretty important to surviving in the Wasteland. Of course, not everyone we meet should be a macho man, and not everyone should respond well to that kind of attitude, but I don't why it should be excluded entirely.

[Postapo]

How is that at all relevant to this W2? I don't see how you could be afraid that chronic cock waggling portrayed as admirable could end up in an rpg if it never did.

NPCs sometimes exhibit swag and the like, but it's in no way constant and the player is left to judge the behavior for himself. PC dialogue options sometimes involve boasting, but they're optional and it's usually assumed the PC is likely bullshitting, when going with it. It's fine the way it is/was, really.

[infestor]

i think wasteland 2 will allow the player to be whatever the character he/she wants to be. ranging from a macho to a sneaky bastard. as for the NPCs, can't touch that.

[homeslice82]

I think you guys are missing my point. Of course it's fine for certain characters to be macho, as long as that's part of the story. I'm saying that I don't want the game to be built on machismo. I don't want every line of dialogue to be various forms of "LOOK AT ALL DAT JUICE" and "BOOYAH". I don't want every character to look like a pro wrestler. I don't want the game to be one continuous brofist.

This is not a controversial point. I think it's pretty obvious that no one here wants this to happen. I just thought I'd articulate it for the developers.

[Postapo]

Like I pointed out: in rpgs it never is. So yeah, no, we covered both interpretations of your two sentence long post.

[danvolodar]

Why not let the player embrace machismo, if he wants to? It's an RPG, there are those things in the dialogs called "options", there's one for everyone!

[Azriel]

I think part of the problem is that all "RPG's" (if you can call them that) today, all have a super macho characters that you are forced to play as. Take dragon age 2, I was a spell caster, but I was forced to play like I warrior and talked like I was ready to kick ass and take names. It really didn't fit the image I wanted my character to be which was a quit, yet thoughtful person. That's why I love the old rpg's you can play YOUR character as you want, not forced to play one type or another. I do agree that I am sick of macho characters and hate it when I am FORCED to play them. I do think wasteland 2 will allow you options, so they people can play the character they want to play.

[tyroie]

I don't want every line of dialogue to be various forms of "LOOK AT ALL DAT JUICE" and "BOOYAH". I don't want every character to look like a pro wrestler. I don't want the game to be one continuous brofist.

I really don't think you'll have to worry about that. I think that kind of stuff is really put in to appeal to non-gamers, or new gamers. WL2 definitely isn't aiming for that audience, if you've followed a lot of the things Fargo's been talking about.

If any characters say those sorts of things, it'll be because the Wasteland is driving them insane, heheh. And it'll be clear about that.

[gool]

[krellen]

Face McGraw takes issue with your telling him he's not allowed to be macho because there's been an Apocalypse. Macho's the thing that makes the Rangers Rangers, soldier.

[Tanglebones]

Face McGraw takes issue with your telling him he's not allowed to be macho because there's been an Apocalypse. Macho's the thing that makes the Rangers Rangers, soldier.

Spencer Hardcastle is sure glad that Face McGraw is there to stand in front of him when the Brass Jerks start shooting, but secretly thinks he's the most valuable member on the team, since he's the one that keeps the old tech working.

[BlackGauntlet]

I don't want the game to be one continuous brofist.

Neither do I. That sounds... painful...

[krellen]

Spencer Hardcastle

Well played.

[Plasmablaster]

I can't find anything machismo-related in the politically correct pulp we've been served recently.

Political correctness and machismo can be combined or not at will. One does not entail the other and vice versa. Example: Dirty Harry or Judge Dredd were both macho and politically incorrect. You can have either one of them or both of them at will.

Usually, propaganda-type games such as Call of Duty utilize both macho-type main hero and lots of political correctness trying to portray the image of the "ideal soldier" who sacrifices himself for his country without straying aside with personality, doubts about the morality of his actions or sincerety of his leaders' true motives. The incentive behind this is plain for all to see.

[Plasmablaster]

As far as the main point of the topic is concerned, I think that an RPG should be above this dilemma (machismo or no machismo). For NPCs, it should portray the world in its glorious omni-present greyiness, that is, there should be macho-types scattered around who either through vanity, self-righteousness or just grim determination towards their goal are in the world to show who's boss and the player will act according to his own taste/preference/interest. About the player,... it's an RPG, let the players play either the super-macho guy or the super-wimp (and anything inbetween) and go along their choice.

What the game should do about machismo (and all vices/virtues for tha matter) is to allow players to see what the consequences of it are.

[Tanglebones]

Spencer Hardcastle

Well played.

I'm probably going to have both a Face McGraw and a Spencer Hardcastle in my first WL2 party now

[krellen]

Spencer Hardcastle

Well played.

I'm probably going to have both a Face McGraw and a Spencer Hardcastle in my first WL2 party now

Me too.