Goral wrote:I would like all those willing to do something themselves to share their earlier work so that all could see what we could expect after such mod kit would be released. I'm betting that 99% of it would be crap which would make mod kit a waste of money since talented and skilled people would make a good mod without a mod kit anyway.
As I already said in this thread before, modding for fallout 2 was really hard. I know this because I tried it myself - in four years I spent many, many hours working on the Fan Made Fallout project, which was subsequently cancelled. You're right in that surely the modding difficulty prevented a lot of bad mods from being made. It also surely prevented a lot of good mods from being made. And sure as hell it failed to prevent all bad mods from being made - ironically enough, one of those bad mods (in my opinion), Wasteland merc 2
, was what triggered me into joining FMF in the first place.
I can say for sure that the modding difficulty was one of the main reasons why Fan Made Fallout never finished. We really tried, and although there were surely a lot of not so good ideas in there, some of it was really good. We also had some really, really talented people on the team (Temaperacl, for instance, whom I've seen lurking about these forums as well), but to make a full conversion mod the size of FMF, it's not enough to have one or two guys that knows how to do the modding, even if you have a group of 40 people to flesh out all the quests and ideas and dialogues. That's what we had in the end: a bunch of maps, about 40 fully fleshed out quests (and over a hundred in the making), a lot of fully written dialogues, new art, including a new world map, loading screens, in game items and scenery, new music and even a couple of talking heads (but no audio for that). All of it very well documented and organized.
In terms of a working product, however, all we managed to get after 7 years or so in the making, was a half-working demo and some prototype in which you could hardly do anything. The actual implementation was, along with too high ambitions, the main reasons why the project was cancelled. And again, that's not because there weren't people who didn't know how to do it - we had those people. Those people just didn't have enough time to implement everything themselves, and so the project died. If it was easier to actually implement
these ideas, then surely the situation would have been much different.
Sadly the FMF forum has been down for a while (I don't know if it's ever coming back up - I suppose you could go to the codex and ask DarkUnderlord about it), but you can catch some glimpses of it through the waybackmachine if you like: http://web.archive.org/web/201001071456 ... om/forums/
In any case, I can see the point you're trying to make, and I disagree. Sure you can make mods without good tools, but those tools make it so that people who might have good ideas and are capable in other ways than programming and hex-editing executables have a good chance of implementing those ideas into a mod that everybody can enjoy. And even if there is no modding toolkit, I think at least the developers can try to make the game as modding friendly as they can for those who are hardcore enough to try modding with only the dev tools (or less) at their disposal.